QotD: Best Wizard, Hands Down

Who is your favorite wizard of all time?

No contest. Technically, his was a knight-monastic order, but he was referred to as a "wizard" by Uncle Owen, so I say that counts. I was four when the movie came out; it was the first I'd ever seen in a theater; and Star Wars was, as Obi-Wan himself put it, my "first step into a larger world." (Propaganda, I tell you, those movies. Thinly-disguised Buddhist recruiting literature! Well -- it worked!)

Yeah, sorry, Gandalf. I love you too, and I love that moment in the movie version of RotK where Denethor is raving away, just completely mad as a hatter, and you bitchslap him with your big stick because nobody has time for that. And you had the sword and you got to go ridin' through the desert on a horse with no knees. But Obi-Wan had a lightsaber. Pwnt.

Obi-Wan "Ben" Kenobi

Comments

[Mark]

What about Nicol Williamson, in Excalibur?

[Profesora Loca]

*hangs head in shame* I actually never saw that. And really, the question isn't fair, because I've also left out Belgarath (and family) in David Eddings's series The Belgariad (and its successor series); Dallben, in Lloyd Alexander's series The Book of Three; and pretty much everybody in Ursula LeGuin's Earthsea Trilogy, and that's just for a start.

My thing about the Istari in LotR: okay, who were the other ones? We have Gandalf the Grey, later promoted to White for unusual incentive in the Balrog matter; Saruman the White; and Radagast the Brown, and So Insignificant He Didn't Make the Movie. Three? Three Istari ever get mentioned, including the one who goes bad? Even for Tolkien, that's taking the "great-man theory of history" a bit far.

[Mark]

Right, who were the other members of the order?   Always wondered that myself - they certainly didn't play much of a role in Middle-Earth, anyway, perhaps off doing other things.     And where did Tom Bombadil come from?   And....

I read something to the effect that Tolkien convinced himself, through his studies of ancient and modern languages, that his imaginarium had actually existed in some form.   This because all languages had words for elf, dwarf, dragon, etc.  

[Mark]

More importantly, who is the Wise Old Man?    Why does such a figure appear in so much literature, arguably back to Odysseus?    He's just a story element that works, obviously, but why does he work for us so well?    Is he an element of Dad?   Or is he the older, unmarried neighbor guy that has probably been around as long as there were humans?     At any rate the general characteristics of this character and the things we expect him to do are universally understood.  

[Mark Edward Achtermann]

Unfinished Tales, edited by CJR Tolkien and published first in 1980, gives somewhat more information about the Istari. I presume, Gwyn, that you have read it or some reference book -- because the word "Istari" never appears in LOTR. According to the 1954 essay on the Istari published in UT, the remaining two wizards (So Insignificant As To Not Merit Mention In LOTR) were simply the "Ithryn Luin" -- Blues Wizards (oh, no -- that's something else -- they were the BLUE wizards)... apparently there were FIVE members of the order in the "North of Middle Earth". But all but Gandalf (Olorin, Incanus, Mithrandir, call him what you like) "fell away".

These "wizards" of Tolkien's, however, are a different case than the wizards of Earthsea, for example, for even if the Earthsea wizards are in some sense dragons, my interpretation of that is that ALL humans are in some sense dragons; this is HUMAN nature (in LeGuin's Earthsea mythos, at any rate). But the Istari/Ithryn are NOT human: they are divine beings, Valar -- or maybe more technically or specifically Maiar. They take human incarnation for their mission, but it is not their fundamental nature. Thus Gandalf's "resurrection" (oops -- did I spoil it for someone? -- sorry) is not quite as splendid as it would have been if, say, Frodo had died and been resurrected. Not that it isn't a splendid thing, and great plot device, to have Gandalf fall in Moria (and no-one says he "died" -- he "fell") and then be out of the action for the rest of the book. But HUMAN technically he's not.

So, to Mark Van Cleve's questions about the archetype of the Wise Old Man. Gandalf fits the archetype, but Tolkien has also (as he often does) tweaked the formula. Gandalf is not an elevated human, but a "descended" deity. But to the psyche this may not matter much. Still, I wouldn't take G as a MODEL any more than I would take Jesus -- rather high above me, I think. (Nor, Gwyn, would I take Simon Tam, but that's another matter, isn't it).

Now, Ged - Sparrowhawk: this guy could be a model. He's a bit of a conceited ass, isn't he: yet in the end he not only saves the world (well, helps), but gets the girl (okay, so she's a middle-aged widow at that point, but hey, you take it when you can, right? My daughter was really pissed that Ged and Tenar didn't get it on at the end of The Tombs of Atuan). Ged is a good guy -- but he is a HUMAN, and that's my point. To be a "wise man" one must first be a man,

As an archetype, though -- well, he's maybe a bit too realistic. Archetypes by definition are more "pure".

I guess we could call Odysseos a "wise man". I'd be more inclined to place him in the related category of "trickster". That sets him with Abram - Abraham (see the haggling scene with the angels on their way to torch Sodom and Gomorrah) and Jacob (four-wife-for-one sale). Are they "wise"? Hmmm. Dunno. Tricksters -- yeah.

Gwyn, Gwyn, Gwyn. BEN KENOBI? No greater love hath a man, than that he should lay his life down for his friends. And Lo, I am with you always. You dig? cardiologists are only the servants of something greater. In my experience, there's no such thing as luck.

But I have one more question for you, since talking about wizards makes me think of fools. Who's the more foolish? The fool, or the fool who follows him?

[Profesora Loca]

I dunno. I've had very good luck recently following what would seem, on their face, to be foolish suggestions. So, as in the movie, I'm going to stick with following the original fool -- who may, per his own dialogue, consider himself a bit daft or forgetful, but who has been alive just that tiny bit longer than I have, and thus may well know something I don't.

[Mark]

OK, but we all know the archetype of the Wise Old Man, just as we know the Hot Blooded Youth, the Young Girl, the Etc.     They work as story characters because we can connect them with someone we know - for each of us, there's someone in our community that plays that role at least sometimes.    So who's the Wise Old Man?     He's not married, dresses strangely at times, and seems to be uncannily knowing about human nature.    He's behind the leader, giving advice.  People might not actually be afraid of him, but he's a bit unsettling.   Who is that?

[Profesora Loca]

I don't even know which archetype I'm supposed to be at the moment. Clearly, I've passed the bloom of the Wildwood Flower, Sugar Magnolia, or whatever you like to call her. Maybe it's the Barefoot Hippie Matron, who isn't especially attractive but gets by on a small amount of sass?

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